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7/07/2021 12:59 am  #91


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

Stickman wrote:

QCS wrote:

TRADE ALERT!

The Carolina Reapers have worked out a deal with the Toronto Beavers to swap Cole Beasley for Trevor Lawrence.

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The Reapers welcome the return of Trevor to the Carolinas and we look forward to the upcoming season!

Okay, lemme make sure I understand this.......  You...... got Trevor Lawrence..... God knows what his potential ceiling could be............. for..... Cole frickin' Beasley?!?!   A #2 receiver.........And that's it?!?!?!   Saying this has the potential to be the all-time fleecing in Alt history doesn't even say it......  good job to QCS for pulling this one off!   Even if it bombs somehow, I'd make this trade 100/100 times!

 
Are we not allowed to veto in the off-season? @gritty

I also lobby for Toronto to go into probation.
1. Tanking in both leagues
2. This trade

Last edited by Thehealthiestscratch (7/07/2021 1:04 am)


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7/07/2021 9:27 am  #92


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

Thehealthiestscratch wrote:

Stickman wrote:

QCS wrote:

TRADE ALERT!

The Carolina Reapers have worked out a deal with the Toronto Beavers to swap Cole Beasley for Trevor Lawrence.

https://i.imgur.com/lxOulnu.png


The Reapers welcome the return of Trevor to the Carolinas and we look forward to the upcoming season!

Okay, lemme make sure I understand this.......  You...... got Trevor Lawrence..... God knows what his potential ceiling could be............. for..... Cole frickin' Beasley?!?!   A #2 receiver.........And that's it?!?!?!   Saying this has the potential to be the all-time fleecing in Alt history doesn't even say it......  good job to QCS for pulling this one off!   Even if it bombs somehow, I'd make this trade 100/100 times!

 
Are we not allowed to veto in the off-season? @gritty

I also lobby for Toronto to go into probation.
1. Tanking in both leagues
2. This trade

Is it considered tanking when you lose, get the top pick (which is the goal of tanking), but then trade what you got for that first pick for Cole Beasley?


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7/07/2021 10:35 am  #93


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

Dan O'Mac wrote:

Thehealthiestscratch wrote:

Stickman wrote:


Okay, lemme make sure I understand this.......  You...... got Trevor Lawrence..... God knows what his potential ceiling could be............. for..... Cole frickin' Beasley?!?!   A #2 receiver.........And that's it?!?!?!   Saying this has the potential to be the all-time fleecing in Alt history doesn't even say it......  good job to QCS for pulling this one off!   Even if it bombs somehow, I'd make this trade 100/100 times!

 
Are we not allowed to veto in the off-season? @gritty

I also lobby for Toronto to go into probation.
1. Tanking in both leagues
2. This trade

Is it considered tanking when you lose, get the top pick (which is the goal of tanking), but then trade what you got for that first pick for Cole Beasley?

That is........ a fair point.   So would it be Trolling instead of Tanking then?     Either way, it's a bad deal that probably should have been vetoed, especially since the trade logic was a pretty quiet first come, first serve basis.  (I for one didn't know that Lawrence was actually available.  I certainly would have given up a lot for him). 

Why not just publicly announcing his intention to trade Trevor to see what the best deal he could have gotten was, (that's how I would have handled it anyway)?  And being clear, I could understand trading him, since he's already got Justin Herbert, who showed a ton of promise last year, if the intent was to use Lawrence to gain a few really nice assets to quickly build the team into a contender. But as it is.... let's just say Beasley better have a AltMadden Cover worthy season to make this deal even a little salvageable...(maybe by the power of not vaccinating, he could! lmao!)


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7/07/2021 10:48 am  #94


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

I will say that the deal was initially a larger trade for both Lawrence and Odell and included some more pieces, but after Boston grabbed Odell it sized down. I'm more than happy to reevaluate the trade and offer more if we feel that's the right thing to do. The trade initially started in the voice call of the Discord server after ThisIsFine had asked us with help to not tank. He had stated that he wanted Wide Receivers and defensive players (and the deal initially included a defensive player) and since he already had Herbert he was willing to deal Lawrence. I jumped on the opportunity first and we hashed out a deal a couple days later.

Edit: And I do find it ironic that Scratch asked about vetoing trades in the off-season when he has made a trade in the off-season that I personally would have vetoed.

Last edited by QCS (7/07/2021 10:49 am)


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7/07/2021 11:55 am  #95


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

Stickman wrote:

Dan O'Mac wrote:

Thehealthiestscratch wrote:


 
Are we not allowed to veto in the off-season? @gritty

I also lobby for Toronto to go into probation.
1. Tanking in both leagues
2. This trade

Is it considered tanking when you lose, get the top pick (which is the goal of tanking), but then trade what you got for that first pick for Cole Beasley?

That is........ a fair point.   So would it be Trolling instead of Tanking then?     Either way, it's a bad deal that probably should have been vetoed, especially since the trade logic was a pretty quiet first come, first serve basis.  (I for one didn't know that Lawrence was actually available.  I certainly would have given up a lot for him). 

Why not just publicly announcing his intention to trade Trevor to see what the best deal he could have gotten was, (that's how I would have handled it anyway)?  And being clear, I could understand trading him, since he's already got Justin Herbert, who showed a ton of promise last year, if the intent was to use Lawrence to gain a few really nice assets to quickly build the team into a contender. But as it is.... let's just say Beasley better have a AltMadden Cover worthy season to make this deal even a little salvageable...(maybe by the power of not vaccinating, he could! lmao!)

The Beavers would like to remain quiet on statements directly regarding the controversy around the Lawrence-Beasley trade, though they would like to state they are looking for a backup for Cole Beasley should he be out of play for any amount of time this season.
 


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7/07/2021 1:15 pm  #96


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

QCS wrote:

I will say that the deal was initially a larger trade for both Lawrence and Odell and included some more pieces, but after Boston grabbed Odell it sized down. I'm more than happy to reevaluate the trade and offer more if we feel that's the right thing to do. The trade initially started in the voice call of the Discord server after ThisIsFine had asked us with help to not tank. He had stated that he wanted Wide Receivers and defensive players (and the deal initially included a defensive player) and since he already had Herbert he was willing to deal Lawrence. I jumped on the opportunity first and we hashed out a deal a couple days later.

Edit: And I do find it ironic that Scratch asked about vetoing trades in the off-season when he has made a trade in the off-season that I personally would have vetoed.

Ironic? It is a joke to compare those two trades. I will happily open up my trade to the counsel (with complete confidence it goes through), if it means we open up a vote on your trade.

Mine was Matthew Tkachuk for Taylor Hall (who is a cheaper keep) and my first round FA pick (which is very valuable in a league of this many players). At best, the trade is a toss up. There is no way it is so lopsided that half of the league doesn't let it go. Tkachuk had a whole 10 points more than Hall and Hall played on the most dysfunctional team in the league. Hall is also likely to sign with a cup contender and be paired with solid players, while Tkachuk is stuck on a team that is on the edge of a full on fire sale. That alone is unfair, but including my first round pick could absolutely throw this trade in Toronto's favor if it is used wisely. 

Yours was an undrafted 32-year-old WR who is consistent (but absolutely not spectacular) for what is expected to be (and will most likely be) a franchise QB in his first year.

Hall was also a first overall pick who has a higher point average over a longer period of time. The guy even averaged 4 fantasy points a game in his last 10 if we want to play "what have you done for me lately". I built this trade to be fair for a team in the rebuilding phase. I don't play the "pull the rug from under you" game because that just is not fun.
 


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7/07/2021 1:32 pm  #97


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

It's a brutal trade on paper for sure but I try not to veto things up front because Lawrence could be an absolute bust and/or not play right away and Beasley could actually help Toronto rather than having Lawrence sitting on the bench with Herbert playing. 

That said, having him reach out looking for advice and then taking Lawrence for Beasley is an absolutely greasy move. You have to know that you're robbing him blind on that deal, but if the league is going to be competitive than people need to learn for themselves and Toronto getting fleeced on this deal should make them actually do a bit of research and put some thought into their deals in the future. I can see both sides of the argument on this honestly and can live with it being vetoed or standing. If we start vetoing trades though it could get real dicey in the future on some deals. Just food for thought.


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7/07/2021 1:46 pm  #98


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

Plain and simple, I don't think vetoing should honestly be a thing. It's not like Madden where all trade restrictions are off and you're just the puppet master over everybody. Two owners are involved in the trade, and it's up to those people to make the deal. If both people are happy with it, good. If one isn't happy with the deal, then it doesn't happen. But QCS and ThisIsFine worked out a deal that both of them, the only owners involved in the trade, agreed on. It's not up to us, the rest of the owners, to say what's best for a team we don't own. Yes, some trades can be pretty brutal, but the owners involved did not have to agree on it. They both agreed on it. Case closed.


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7/07/2021 2:18 pm  #99


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

ANDY! wrote:

Plain and simple, I don't think vetoing should honestly be a thing. It's not like Madden where all trade restrictions are off and you're just the puppet master over everybody. Two owners are involved in the trade, and it's up to those people to make the deal. If both people are happy with it, good. If one isn't happy with the deal, then it doesn't happen. But QCS and ThisIsFine worked out a deal that both of them, the only owners involved in the trade, agreed on. It's not up to us, the rest of the owners, to say what's best for a team we don't own. Yes, some trades can be pretty brutal, but the owners involved did not have to agree on it. They both agreed on it. Case closed.

We definitely have say in what's best for the league, though. I get some people don't think it should be a thing, but it is a consistent part of fantasy. It has already been put in place for our league and there is no reason it shouldn't be consistent until a commissioner removes that aspect through whatever means. It doesn't make a difference when you can make the playoffs at 7-6, but seeing that move make a team in a division that claimed 4 playoffs spots even stronger at the expense of the only below par team in that division is not beneficial for the league as a whole. 


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7/07/2021 3:50 pm  #100


Re: The AltFL Season 2021

Given that there's no way the Beasley for Lawrence swap would pass muster if it was subject to a veto, I'm proposing this alternate for the community's review. ThisIsFine and I have agreed to it, but I want to make sure it doesn't cause any more controversy here.

CAR receives: Trevor Lawrence
TOR receives: Cole Beasley, Brandon Cooks, Derrick Brown, CAR's highest main draft pick

I'd like that every trade be subject to a veto or no trade is - having it both ways is wrong. Scratch, the trade I was talking about was the KC-NY swap that we received absolutely no word on before it went into effect, leaving no time for us to even discuss. In my opinion, the fact that New York didn't have to give up their original rookie draft pick and received an extra player from KC in exchange for what could very well be an incredible QB. That wasn't a balanced trade, in my opinion, and should've included NY's original rookie draft pick or shouldn't have included that extra player from KC. So you claiming that you want things to be consistent when you yourself have benefited (although in this case you didn't benefit from it) from things being inconsistent is what I have an issue with. Would that trade have been vetoed by the community? I don't know. But I'm upset that we didn't even get a chance and now you're calling for everything to be subject to review.

But either way, I'd like to just put this behind us as a learning experience. Every trade should be subject to community review, no matter what, or none of them should be. I'm on the side of keeping the veto, personally, but I'm even more on the side of consistency.
 


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